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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:96
Level:Superstar
Since:Aug 24, 2006
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So there's no evidence they filmed the Rams before Super Bowl XXXVI. They broke the rules in their 2007 season opener against the New York Jets. And in that 2002 game with the Chargers. And in the 2001 AFC Championship Game. And in a 2001 date with Buffalo ... and Miami ... and Cleveland.
Now we find out they knew that what they were doing was wrong. At least that's what Matt Walsh said. And, sure, it's fair to ask why we should believe Matt Walsh over Bill Belichick. Well, maybe because the NFL commissioner just told you he does.
And that may be the most disturbing revelation from Spygate's final act.
This was part of an article also on cbs.sports I could print more of it but I am sure you already read it. This is more damaging, I believe something should be done with this. There are cheaters in more ways than one. Sorry there not off the hook infact more intangled in it.
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:90
Level:All-Star
Since:Jan 9, 2008
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Spectre is calling for a Mitchell like investigation into spygate.
http://www.globesports.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080514.wsptspec14/GSStory/GlobeSportsFootb
all/home
This has gone beyond rediculious. Hasn't the American Senate have anything better to do? This guy is the senior Rep on the judicial committee... Is he up for re-election? I'm sure there a lot of fans in Pennsylvania that will vote him back in because of this stance.
Yes they cheated, but my god this is gone to looney land.
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:73
Level:Pro
Since:Oct 22, 2007
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Cheating Patriots History:
1. The "snowblower" incident
2. The "tuck rule"
3. Videotaping and destroying the evidence
4. Player tampering
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:98
Level:Superstar
Since:Jun 21, 2007
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The rest of their lives the Patriots will have to justify they won the Super Bowls and didn't need the help from the cheating coach. They will never be able to do that, ever. We can never prove the wouldn't have won either way.
The difference, the Manning brothers don't have to explain the shine on the Super Bowl trophy they each have won.
Brady will always have the tarnish on his. One clean is better than three tainted.
It was proved they cheated. The rest is speculation on both sides.
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:93
Level:All-Star
Since:Mar 15, 2008
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i think eveyone owes the new england paltriots a big apologie
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:85
Level:All-Star
Since:Dec 7, 2007
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Excuse me, but did you say a single incident?!!! Did you not read the story that said the Gaytriots have been taping since, what, 2000? That is not an isolated incident. That is blatant cheating. What do you people gain by trying to make it seem like it was just the position of the camera that lost them a draft pick, and cost the organization 250,000.00? The coach was fined for positioning the camera at the wrong angle? Please give me a break!!! New England fans are wonderful at calling people hater, and moron, but can't or won't face the truth about what constitutes a moron. It is moronic to believe that the fines and penalties were imposed simply because a camera was in the wrong place.
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:93
Level:All-Star
Since:Mar 22, 2008
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If if's and but's were candy and nuts, we'd all have a Merry Christmas...Unfornately there not, so we have to do with the facts we have. The Patriots broke the rules (or cheated if you prefer) got caught and then punished.
Until another team has hard definitive evidence of videotaping other teams signals brought against them, the Patriots are the only team we can say did this, and they will remain the "black sheep" of the league.
Patriots can use all the "logic" and hearsay they want, but it doesn't change a thing. I really don't care that they videotaped the signals, but don't be a meatball and try drag the whole league into Belicheat's mess.
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:99
Level:Superstar
Since:Aug 27, 2006
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thank god... finally someone who sums up my thoughts. most non-pats fans just want you to admit that they cheated and you disapprove. most non-pats fans would move on. as a giant fan, i don't have to worry about it... we all know that.
there were no walkthru tapes, but, there was still cheating. they were caught and punished. don't dismiss it like it didn't happen because there was no further evidence... just say yes, they cheated and we'll all move on.
and lastly... there are "haters" of all teams... god i hate that term... it's like we are just a super dumbed down slang society. 1 million stewart scott's talking like it's the 11pm sportscenter.... people hate other teams more because of arrogant fans then their performance on the field. pats and yankees haven't won in years, but people hate them (and love them) more because of the arrogant fans (in my opinion). football is cyclical... enjoy success now, because it won't be there forever... more importantly... show some class and don't insult and attack everyone who disagrees with you... its childish not to.
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:99
Level:Superstar
Since:Aug 27, 2006
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apology for what? if they weren't already convicted of cheating (ok, convicted is strong, but, they were guilty and punished... so, allow me my artistic license), nobody would have ever assumed the original article was true.
for crying out loud...just say, "they cheated... they were punished... it's over" and you'd get more respect then you could possibly imagine.
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:94
Level:All-Star
Since:Aug 20, 2006
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You are right about Belichick's actions being a mistake. The NFL's previous commissioners set a precedent in the league that this type of activity would be overlooked and rules concerning it would not be enforced, at least not in any meaningful way. This created an environment where this type of activity was commonplace and practiced widely.
It has been the contention of some Pats fans, myself included, that the practice of stealing signals is deeply rooted in the NFL due to the leagues inaction and lack of enforcement.
Pats haters claim that the Patriots are the only team that has been caught videotaping. That's simply not true. The Jets were caught taping in Foxboro the year before. There is a long list of accusations against other teams for various other forms of signal stealing and what even the Haters would define as "cheating".
Take a look at the items listed below and the links in my sources and ask yourself if the situation is as cut-and-dried as the Haters make it seem. There's plenty of probable cause to justify a league-wide investigation into all teams taping practices. But so far, the league and the Haters don't want that.
Here are some other interesting facts that the Haters always ignore:
1. The Patriots caught the Jets filming in the end zone in Foxboro in 2006. The Jets said that the Pats had given them permission, which they clearly hadn't because Pats asked the cameraman to leave. The league did nothing but to say it was okay and did not confiscate tapes or investigate. The Jets were supposedly filming "coaching video".
2. The Dolphins bought game tapes of the Patriots to study Tom Brady's audibles before a MNF game in Dec 2006. Zach Thomas admitted to knowing all Brady's signals from the tape study. The league ruled that such tape study is okay.
3. Denver Broncos coach Mike Shanahan admitted in 2002 to hiring lip readers to steal signals. He bragged that his lipreaders could get all the signals by the end of the 1st half, sometimes by the end of the 1st quarter.
4. The Jets were accused of cheating by calling illegal audibles in a game against the Ravens. Brian Billick said that the illegal audibles by the Jets resulted in 3 offside penalties.
5. The KC Chiefs admitted that they had somehow got hold of a 49ers playbook and memorized it before a game against the niners. KC knew every play that KC called before the snap. This was when Tony Dungy was with KC.
6. The Raiders, Broncos, Steelers, and 49ers were all caught cheating on salary cap limits and all were fined and lost draft picks.
7. Former Dallas Cowboy coaches Barry Switzer and Jimmy Johnson admitted to doing "similar stunts" (video taping) while they were coaching.
8. Former Raiders player Howie Long said in USA Today that "anybody who thinks the Patriots are the only club spying on other teams is 'naive.'"
9. Former Eagles QB Ron Jaworski admitted that when he played, his backup QB would spy on the defense and signal Jaws by dropping red flags to indicate blitzes. He also said that he had no problem with Pats taping the Rams before 2001 SB.
10. Current KC coach Herm Edwards said that, "There isn't a team in the league that doesn't try to steal signals [but] I haven't heard about teams recording footage like the Patriots were," said one longtime NFL assistant coach. "But you can bet everybody is trying to steal in some way. In fact, you can go to any NFL game and you'll find some coach whose sole job is to look for defensive signals."
11. Former Steeler's coach Chuck Knoll said that signal stealing is "a whole lot about nothing".
12. Dan Rooney of the Pittsburgh Steelers stated, "We consider the tapes of our coaching staff during our games against the New England Patriots to be a non-issue," Rooney said in a statement. "In our opinion, they had no impact on the results of those games."
13. According to the NFL rules, teams are allowed to tape "coaching video" from an upper level location or from the end zones with no restrictions so long as both teams have access to the location. Such taping does not require league permission. No one seems to know exactly what "coaching video" is, that there is any review or monitoring of what gets taped, and the NFL doesn't make it's official rule book public.
But this rule seems to be a direct contradiction of the following "rules":
Page 105 of the Game Operations manual says: "No video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game." It later says: "All video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead."
And, a memo from Ray Anderson, NFL head of football operations, to head coaches and GMs on Sept. 6, 2006 said: "Video taping of any type, including but not limited to taping of an opponent’s offensive or defensive signals, is prohibited on the sidelines, in the coaches’ booth, in the locker room, or at any other locations accessible to club staff members during the game."
The first rule states that video taping is allowed from an upper level location to make "coaching video", but the other 2 say that video taping is not allowed in "areas accessible to staff members."
Also note that rule regarding taping that the Pats were disciplined for in this year was also in place at the time the Jets were caught taping at Foxboro. The Pats were investigated and penalized, the Jets were not.
None of these things justify or excuse the Pats for violating a rule, but the Haters and the league are not doing the same thing to other teams.
The team should not be condemned for the actions of a coach who is doing what a lot of other coaches and teams have been doing for a long time.
Source(s):
1. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story...
1. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story...
1. http://nationalpost.pa-sportsticker.com/...
1. http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/footba...
2. http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/...
3. http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/inside_...
4. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story...
4. http://www.boston.com/sports/football/ar...
5. http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/sto...
6. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/art...
6. http://blog.footballguys.com/2007/09/11/...
7/8. http://www.usatoday.com/sports/columnist...
9. http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/tag/Steve...
10/11. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/st...
12. http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap...
13. http://www.boston.com/sports/football/pa...
13. http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5...
Misc links:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/st...
http://www.sptimes.com/2007/09/14/Bucs/I...
http://thesportslawprofessor.blogspot.co...
http://sports-law.blogspot.com/2007/09/s...
http://thesportslawprofessor.blogspot.co...
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:96
Level:Superstar
Since:Apr 18, 2008
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The Patriots are cheaters!! The commish never said it was ok because if he thought it was ok then he wouldn't have taken away their first round draft pick for camera locations. The patriots are cheaters because any team that has coaching signals can pretty much know what is coming up offensively and defensively and make adjustments that is ia major advantage for the patriots and an disadvantage for thr other team they filmed which in turn makes them cheaters in my book.
i always felt that boston fans like thier sports announcers were biased and other things that i won't say but in this case you cannot deny the truth.
18-1!!...lol......GO Giants
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:99
Level:Superstar
Since:Aug 27, 2006
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dude... waaay to long to read it all... but... much like w/steroids... you need evidence to prove fault. speculation is inherent in all things like this... but... the facts are the facts... if everyone is doing it, why is it the pats are the only ones who were caught?
you've come halfway... you've admitted your favorite teams guilt... great... now, rather then trying to justify it by saying everyone else does it, just let it die. i promise you, it will die if everyone just said, "they cheated... they've paid the price".
You want it to go away... but, then you make arguments that "haters" (UGH with this frickin word.... is this a high school locker room?!?!?!?!) ignore facts. The fact is that, the facts you say hear are hearsay or conjecture made by people. They differ with the facts that got NE punished for cheating. There was concrete evidence. Until someone shows me otherwise, I can't lump every team in the NFL into cheaters.
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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like i kept saying THE WHOLE TIME
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Reputation:94
Level:All-Star
Since:Sep 21, 2006
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